What do you call a fatwah when it’s called for by a Catholic priest?
Good holy moly, have all the preachers and priests gone completely bat-shit insane? Nah, just the ones connected to Obama and Jesse Jackson, so far at least. Check this out:
An Illinois gun-rights group says it plans to complain to the Catholic Church after a Chicago priest at the weekend appeared to call for the murder of a suburban gun shop owner.
During a Rainbow/PUSH Coalition protest at Chuck’s Gun Shop & Range on Saturday, the Rev. Michael Pfleger, pastor of St. Sabina’s Church, threatened to “snuff” shop owner John Riggio.
The Illinois State Rifle Association (ISRA) has posted online what is says is a recording of Pfleger’s remarks.
In the audio clip, the priest is heard being introduced to the crowd by the Rev. Jesse Jackson. Immediately thereafter, Pfleger launches into a tirade.
“I want the NRA [National Rifle Association] to understand - you have a lot of money, but money can’t buy moral authority and it can’t buy justice or freedom, and we will fight you, NRA,” he says.
“We will fight you on every angle [sic], no matter how much money you’ve got, we will embarrass you, and we will embarrass every legislator that takes money from you. We will call them out by name, by district. We will expose you, legislators.”
Pfleger then turns his attention to Riggio. “He’s the owner of Chuck’s. John Riggio. R-i-g-g-i-o. We’re going to find you and snuff you out … you know you’re going to hide like a rat. You’re going to hide but like a rat we’re going to catch you and pull you out. We are not going to allow you to continue to hide when we’re here …”
“We’re going to keep coming back, and like Reverend Jackson says, it takes civil disobedience, if it takes whatever it takes … we’re going to snuff out John Riggio, we’re going to snuff out legislators that are voting … and we are coming for you because we are not going to sit idly. Keep on fighting, people. Keep on fighting, keep on fighting.”
I have NO IDEA what the general context of this is, what exactly they’re protesting, or what they expect to accomplish by “snuffing out” legal gun shop owners, so don’t ask me. It doesn’t matter anyway, does it?
Just FYI, this Pfleger guy is white.
In any case…wow. I don’t even have any commentary about this, it’s just so incredibly bizarre that a priest wearing his priest clothes would stand in a public place and yell those things after being introduced by someone who I’m supposed to take seriously. Which, please. Does anyone actually take Jesse seriously? Anyone?
I just hope John Riggio keeps his doors locked and his personal guns loaded.
More about this Pfleger douchebag at Hot Air, including video of him defending Rev. Wright and Louis Farrahkhan. He’s a real charmer.
I’m pretty sure he meant to “snuff out” his business, but the words were irresponsibly chosen.
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:46 pmIt’s not surprising after seeing his sermon. There is a link at Michelle Malkin’s site…
http://michellemalkin.com/2008/03/29/rev-michael-pfleger-and-rev-jeremiah-wright-together-again-hallelujah/
It’s the 2nd one…
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:48 pmTough to say, really. On one hand, he never actually uses the word “kill” and it’s entirely possible he intended “snuff out” to mean “run him out of business”.
On the other hand, he also went out of his way to spell out the guy’s name to the crowd, as if he were telling them exactly who to “snuff”.
Either way, I think that if some psycho does decide try to kill the store owner, this “priest” should be charged with inciting violence.
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:55 pmThe Pfleger guy - or “Snuffy” as we like to call him - is quite possibly one of the most repugnant, festering pieces of shit ever to walk this earth. He not only condones violence if it supports his political means, but he vociferously demands it of his batshiat crazy followers. I’ve written about that fetid sack of rotting effluvia for a while now. He really is one of the most repulsive creatures ever to walk this earth.
April 3rd, 2008 at 8:57 pmWhat an idiot. … Let’s see…put someone who (in his mind) “promotes” violence by promoting violence. Yup. Perfectly logical for a liberal. Sheesh.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:12 pmEvery gun store I patronize has an armed staff. Duh! Not exactly an easy target. What sort of stupid people pick on armed and trained opponents? I see a Darwin Award in the near future.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:14 pmUsually I’m a staunch supporter of the bureaucratic hierarchy of the Church, believing it to be the glue that holds the system together and keeps wild preacher types from pushing their own agenda. But I can’t defend it here…the Archdiocese of Chicago has done a major disservice to its members, especially its minority ones. The Archbishop isn’t going to touch Pfleger because of his tenure and his nack (sp?) for pulling in minorities, which is something the Catholic Church in America is lacking. The federal authorities aren’t going to strip his congregation of its tax-exemption because of, once again, its minority status. If you were those two organizations you wouldn’t get your justified actions off the ground without being mauled by Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, yada yada.
I have been told time and time again by Catholic priests that they aren’t allowed to publicly endorse political candidates, though they wish they could (fortunately most of the ones I know are solid conservatives). I don’t even think the Kennedy-worshiping sect of “catholicism” in New England has ever gone this far.
The funny thing about his untouch-ability? He’s white. He’s just another Jim Jones, leading his flock to the kool-aid.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:16 pmI thought Al Gore got another job and just sucks at it too. Sure reminded me of him for some reason.
Note to self- get directions to that peyote church in Arizona. See if they are accepting applications for monks to tend the cactii.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:17 pmClips of this guy were all over the evening news and pundit shows. I was hoping you’d pick this up because he seems totally psycho.
Wonder if Pope Benedict will be going to Chicago during his April visit.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:25 pmAll I can think of reading this is “Never take a knife to a gun fight.” And since he’s anti-gun, which would make one assume that his followers are also anti-gun, exactly how they plan on doing any “snuffing” of a gun shop owner without first being “snuffed” themselves is a mystery.
I can’t wait until I buy my .45 Baby Eagle.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:30 pmIt’s a bit too much like King Henry’s “Oh who would rid me of this troublesome priest?” I hope the gun shop owner got some kind of restraining order to help build a case.
What’s with the nearly year-old news?
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:44 pmFunny how the Rev. and the blacks are so down on the ONLY organization that worked to help blacks keep self defense arms in the Jim Crow south, isn’t it?
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:45 pm“I want the NRA [National Rifle Association] to understand - you have a lot of money, but money can’t buy moral authority and it can’t buy justice or freedom, and we will fight you, NRA,” he says. Okayyyyy….This guy is talking about buying MORAL AUTHORITY? Wait a second…didn’t the Catholic Church in the U.S. already have first go at trying to buy moral authority in the form of hush money? I feel bad saying that as a Catholic, but damnit–just because you have the title “Father” in front of your name doesn’t give you carte blanche to pass judgement on people.
April 3rd, 2008 at 9:58 pmI am VERY Catholic (Latin Mass and the whole thing) and I live in the Archdiocese of Chicago. Pfleger is an embarrassment.
Generally I like Cardinal George (Pfleger’s boss) however in this case he has been too passive. Granted, the Cardinal is between a rock and a hard place. Pfleger is a demagogue and if he is moved or if he is retired then he has made it clear that he will leave and make more trouble. I imagine that nobody wants him stopped more than Chicago Catholics and Cardinal George.
I hear that in some ways the Archdiocese utilizes Pfleger as a sort of ‘fly paper strategy’. All the crazys flock together to his parish… where they are a bit easier to manage. On some level better to have them all there than all over the place.
This particular story (Pfleger threatening gun shop owners) is actually fairly old. I seem to remember that he was brought in to the Cardinal for a private meeting (I imagine it was a rebuke). The Cardinal then spoke out against Fr. Pfleger’s statements.
People imagine that the Catholic Church has more control of it’s people than it really does. Sometimes (usually when Pfleger is in the news) it is easy to miss the inquisition - which would have cleaned this problem right up. (kidding - mostly)
April 3rd, 2008 at 10:09 pmDavid Codrea has been covering “Snuffy” for some time as well. Totally repugnant.
April 3rd, 2008 at 10:51 pmThis wackjob of a priest is a big fan of Louis Farrakhan and a defender of Jeremiah Wright. ‘Nuff said.
May he be butthurt by a thousand altar boys.
April 3rd, 2008 at 10:54 pmHe also mentioned snuffing out the legislature. And the government hates to have their own people threatened.
April 4th, 2008 at 2:28 amOh gawd, too early for this. My coffee-splattered keyboard thanks you for the humor, evvybuns.
April 4th, 2008 at 5:29 amHe’s just following in Coughlin’s footsteps.
Must be something in the Great Lakes’ water that makes ministers go bat shit.
April 4th, 2008 at 5:52 amIf you notice, the date on that article is May of 2007. In June of 2008, Cardinal George of Chicago actually rebuked Pfleger publically for these remarks:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1846964/posts
I am from Chicago and am familiar with Fr. Pfleger’s activities in the black community. He is a “community activist” whose activism reaches far beyond his duties at the pulpit. Not your usual parish priest by any stretch of the imagination.
In this case, the Cardinal seems to be hamstrung by the same political correctness trap that forbids any criticism of Blacks without being called a racist.
April 4th, 2008 at 6:02 amWell, who do you think invented “Liberation Theology” anyway?
Every time I read about a rabble-rousing Liberal priest in Chicago, I’m pretty sure it’s going to be my brother. Haven’t seen his name in the news yet. He’s a rabid Obama supporter, so there’s still time.
::sigh::
April 4th, 2008 at 6:27 am– illegal
April 4th, 2008 at 6:33 amMy opinion of the Catholic Church gets lower every day (Church, not catholics themselves). On top of that there was another white catholic priest God Damning America in his pulpit this week, and defending Hitler-wanna-be Louis Farrakahn as a saint.
April 4th, 2008 at 7:23 amWhat mary martha said. This guy is a total fruitcake and his views are not at all those of the average Catholic in the pew. BTW, John Paul II put the smackdown on liberation theologists in South and Central America pretty heavily. Too bad the North Americans won’t listen. The idiots.
April 4th, 2008 at 7:36 amDude should be in jail.
April 4th, 2008 at 7:37 amQuick question: is Pfleger a real ordained Roman Catholic priest, or a fakey so-called reverend/pastor like Jackson and Sharpton? Or is he a “priest” in one of those new aggregate religions like Unitarians or whatnot?
UPDATE: Whoops. I just scrolled up and read Mary Martha’s comment. Question answered.
BTW, evvybuns - seriously, girl - you crack me up!
April 4th, 2008 at 8:21 amI think he needs a dose of the new wrestling move they’re teaching in the catholic high schools. It starts with the Half Nelson, shifts into the Full Nelson, ends up as the “Father Nelson.”
April 4th, 2008 at 8:26 amSorry, but I had to laugh because I think the guy showed his utter ignorance using the word ’snuff’ when I’m pretty certain he meant “sniff out” as in expose them. At least that’s how it seems to me.
Doesn’t mean he’s any less dangerous — stupidity is incredibly dangerous.
April 4th, 2008 at 8:29 amMust have been hitting the communion wine a little heavily!
April 4th, 2008 at 8:35 amThere is way too much funny in this story. The moral authority thing just makes me cackle. Money can’t buy you moral authority? And you’ve got Jesse Jackson standing behind you and don’t see the irony in that statement? Also, whether he was threatening violence or just threatening to find the guy… um… I just love it when the anti-gun nuts threaten the people with the guns. Shows how very very smart they are.
April 4th, 2008 at 8:38 amWell this guy is just an attention whore. He’s intoxicated by his rage and grossly inflated sense of relevance. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out he’s also gay as he obviously yearns to be an “oppressed” minority.
I wonder if angry gay spittle spray justifies the use of deadly force? Hmmmmmm.
April 4th, 2008 at 8:48 amDearRachel,
It is not a fawtah because he did not call for the gun shop owner to be killed for a religious violation. (you use “fatwah.” I really got no idea which is correct).
As a Catholic, I doubt this guy has any kind of sanction/support from the Chicago Diocese, so his activities should not be held against the Catholic Church as a whole. Kind of like the Berrigan brothers, he’s just another example of a nut who happens to be a priest. Why the Chicago Bishop hasnt removed him from his priestly duties is beyond me.
I am kind of curious if there is a Christian/Catholic equivalent to the fawtah, not that I’d expect there to be. The harshest Catholic punishment is, after all, Excommunication (disallowing participation in the sacrament of Communion).
April 4th, 2008 at 9:01 amYr Ob Svnt
mike
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F56ZZzz4meU&feature=related
April 4th, 2008 at 9:26 amMaybe the Inquisition could be brought back. I’ve always loved the title of “Grand Inquisitor.” Or burn the guy at the stake? Crucifixion is right out because that was a Roman thing, despite its heavy Christian symbolism for the last 2,000 years.
April 4th, 2008 at 9:42 amFantastic! Send anti-gun nuts with violent intentions to a law abiding gun owner’s home or business. I’m kind of thinking the odds are stacked against them. What are they going to do? Slap him with protest signs?
April 4th, 2008 at 10:56 amFor those of you who watched the clip that Rachel linked but failed to read the comments, I offer you up this jewel:
April 4th, 2008 at 11:01 amDearRachel,
I. Cannot. Resist.
evvybuns: “Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.”
mike
April 4th, 2008 at 11:34 amLawless thugs are gunning each other down in the streets. If they did not have guns, they would all be nice and peacable and hold real and productive jobs. It is only the evil gun shops forcing guns into the hands of otherwise law abiding poor black children who instigate the death and destruction in the projects and blighted urban areas.
It’s all whitey’s fault! Whitey should kill himself and bring peace and justice and equality to the downtrodden black community. I think Rev What’s His Moosh should lead the way!
April 4th, 2008 at 12:05 pmHmm… Just scanned through the comments so far, to see if this had been posted by anyone else, didn’t see it. I went to Obama’s church’s website last month and looked it over, because of a post somewhere about them removing some anti-white comments from it, and found the church’s newsletter. Check out this item from it, mentioning Pfleger:
I can get behind putting up a reward for helping find the shooter, but these people need to have it hammered into their heads that gun laws do nothing to stop criminals from obtaining and using guns.
April 4th, 2008 at 12:19 pmOne wonders if he’s aware that the Catechism holds that self-defense (which, in Catholic doctrine, may include killing the attacker, though it is only allowed as a side-effect rather than as a deliberate outcome; ie the intent must be merely to stop the attack, rather than specifically to kill the attacker) is not just a right, but a duty?
(See the Catechism, 2263-2265.)
That this doctrine goes back all the way to Aquinas?
I’m an atheist, and I know that self-defense is lawful under Catholic doctrine.
How in Hell can a priest not know it?
How can he demand that someone providing the means for the Catholic duty of defense of others be driven out of business (to give his words the most charitable interpretation)?
April 4th, 2008 at 12:23 pmNot to hijack the thread here, but maybe Joan or one of the others could spare me a few words on the whole “liberation theology”?
What I’ve read: That it’s Marxist in tone and it doesn’t put enough emphasis on redemption/the Resurrection.
What my (Episcopal) priest said: It’s about reading the Bible from the point of view of the poor in order to gain another perspective. There is certainly room for parts of Marxism to overlap parts of RT, but one does not necessarily equate to the other.
What exactly did the Pope object to?
If you don’t want to steal Rachel’s bandwidth, you can reach me at yahoo dot com. Address is just what you think it is.
April 4th, 2008 at 2:25 pmI want to agree with Mary Martha. Father Pfleger is clearly very much against the spirit of actual Catholic teaching (and probably against the letter, too, but I haven’t yet done enough research to boil it down to quotations from the catechism). It’s important to remember that once a man is ordained a priest, he forever retains the ability to exercise that office (making the sacrament, hearing confessions, and so on), even if he rejects Church teaching or Catholic morality or just common decency. I suspect there are a lot of Catholics who agree with Mary Martha (and me) that Fr. Pfleger does not represent the views of Catholics; in fact I join with those who repudiate his divisive and bitter attempt to foster controversy, anger, and hate.
April 4th, 2008 at 2:45 pmPfleger’s followers probably think he’s a saint.
Let’s submit him for cannonization. I know a guy who can supply the cannon.
Shouldn’t the Secret Service be interested in what amounts to death threats against sitting legislators?
April 4th, 2008 at 4:04 pmAh, Father Pfleger. A loose cannon renegade of a priest. Francis Cardinal George needs to get a size 17 tube sock pronto and stuff it down this idiot’s throat. Then rip off his Roman collar and dance an adagio on it.
April 4th, 2008 at 4:59 pmActually I think Jackson and Sharpton are ordained ministers, but I see what you mean. I also wonder if Pfleger actually preaches in a real, physical church.
Oh, he knows it. I’m sure of it. He’s just purposely choosing to ignore it.
April 4th, 2008 at 5:33 pmSpanish Inquisition
April 4th, 2008 at 9:58 pmSigivald: thank you for pointing this out
i’d just like to clarify that the catechism says grave duty. “grave” in Catholic-speak carries the weight of “neglect this duty at peril to your soul”
“Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for someone responsible for another’s life.” (CCC 2265)
April 5th, 2008 at 10:38 ami’d just like to add this:
April 5th, 2008 at 3:51 pmSnuffy Phlegmer got arrested along with Jesse Jackass last year for “protesting” in front of Riggio’s place of business, interfering with legitimate activities and trying to destroy his livelihood. I know he’s an ordained Catholic Priest, but every time people call him “Father,” I get a rancid case of acid reflux. He’s a repulsive piece of shit.
April 5th, 2008 at 3:52 pmIIRC, a few years back the NAACP brought a lawsuit against a number of gunmakers. Their case was based on the fact that most gun homicides were perpretrated by young black men against other young black men. Therefore, the gun manufacturers were negligent in selling guns to black men and were liable for the deaths of the black victims.
This prompted an amicus brief from the KKK supporting the NAACP case. The brief affirmed the KKK’s belief that blacks shouldn’t be able to buy or own guns and agreed with the NAACP position.
A few weeks later the NAACP quietly dropped the lawsuit.
April 6th, 2008 at 1:49 am